Dialogue with Nur-el-Masih Ben Haq

This is the continuation of a discussion with Nur-el-Masih Ben Haq, taken from here.

 

Is English law related to Muslim law?

Taken from BBC World News:

In London’s historic “Inns of Court”, barristers practise law in the shadow of the distinctive medieval Temple Church. But does English law really owe a debt to Muslim law?

For some scholars, a historical connection to Islam is a “missing link” that explains why English common law is so different from classical Roman legal systems that hold sway across much of the rest of Europe.

 

YHWH The Arm God?

I was reading through Islamic and non-islamic sites doing research as usual when I happened upon a youtube video. As I turned on the video I was met by the most insufferable of voices, This voice (if it be proper to call the vile shrieks a voice) attempted, without avail, to tell me that my God was a leg. He cited the following ayah from the Quran to prove this:

The Day that the shin shall be laid bare, and they shall be summoned to bow in adoration, but they shall not be able, Quran 68:42

 

Who are the Seven Gentile Prophets mentioned in the Talmud?

There has been much intrigue after my article on the idea of non-Jewish prophets in the Bible. The Jews were quite open to the idea of prophets being sent to even non-Jewish nations as I have already demonstrated. But let us look and critically examine what we do know of these seven Gentile prophets that are explicitely mentioned by name in the Talmud (Baba Bathra 15b).

 

Do Jews and Christians Really Know Their Prophets Part II

Do Jews and Christians know their Prophets Part II

It is from God that we receive prophets and from those prophets we are given God’s revelations. It seems that much quarreling has come about from the arguing over what constitutes scripture. Perhaps the biggest motive for rejecting divinely sanctioned writings is that it goes against a theological bias. Scripture should define our beliefs; it should not be our preconceived beliefs that define what is scripture. One would find one hard pressed to think of a prophet who did not come with a message that did not insult people, because God does not send messengers to tell people to continue in their ways but rather to give correction to a fallen people who have left the path that was laid down afore time. The Jews could perhaps be proven to be the most guilty of such an offense. While signs and wonders were before them, they fashioned a calf in which to worship. When they did not like a prophet that convicted them of their abominations they simply killed him. And as I will shortly prove if they did not like what established scripture said threw the entire book out of the corpus of religious writings.

In the Talmud there are several times that the book of Ben Sirah is shown to be considered authoritative In one particular tractate of the Talmud a man is told not to speculate about things he does not understand and is quoted the following:

Thus far you have permission to speak, thenceforward you have not permission to speak, for so it is written in the Book of Ben Sirah: Seek not things that are too hard for thee, and search not things that are hidden from thee. The things that have been permitted  thee, think thereupon; thou hast no business with6 the things that are secret.

This is a direct quote from Wisdom of Sirah  3:21-22. Wisdom of Sirah is not just quoted in Hagigah but also referenced in tractate Nidah of the Talmud where the quote is intoduced with the formula only reserved for scripture! But the most striking reference in the Talmud is where wisdom of Sirah is quoted as being part of the Old Testament Hagiographa! According to the jews there are 3 divisions of the Old Testament the first being the Torah [Instruction] (The first five books of the law said to have been revealed to prophet Moses), the Nevi’im [Prophets] (The division of books attributed to the prophets of Israel) and the Ketuvim [Writings] ( This is a collection of God inspired writings that include the book of Daniel and the writings of Prophet David amongst others)

In tractate Baba Kama 92b it states the following:

Raba [again] said to Rabbah b. Mari: Whence can be derived the popular saying, ‘A bad palm will usually make its way to a grove of barren trees’? — He replied: This matter was written in the Pentateuch [Torah], repeated in the Prophets[Nevi'im] , mentioned a third time in the Hagiographa [Ketuvim], and also learnt in a Mishnah and taught in a Baraitha: It is stated in the Pentateuch as written, So Esau went unto Ishmael; repeated in the prophets, as written, And there gathered themselves to Jephthah idle men and they went out with him; mentioned a third time in the Hagiographa [Ketuvim], as written: Every fowl dwells near its kind and man near his equal;

The portioned that is designated as part of the Ketuvim is a direct quote from Wisdom of Sirah 13:15. It is undeniable that at one time the Jews held this book to be sacred scripture but chose to abandon it. But what could have possibly changed? Is it just coincidence that this book was used by early Christians to prove that Jesus was the messiah? This seems to be a strong enough motive, if they would willing to kill God’s prophets is it then unreasonable that they would throw out a book pointing to his authority? The question still remains, was Sirah a prophet or does the answer depend on whether the Jews find it convenient that day to recognize him?

It is from God that we receive prophets and from those prophets we are given God’s revelations. It seems that much quarreling has come about from the arguing over what constitutes scripture. Perhaps the biggest motive for rejecting divinely sanctioned writings is that it goes against a theological bias. Scripture should define our beliefs; it should not be our preconceived beliefs that define what is scripture.

 

Do Jews and Christians really know their Prophets?

I find it truly amazing at times how people do not know their own religions beliefs yet feel fit to

criticize the religious beliefs of others. Many times a person will attack a religion such as Islam

for a trivial matter yet do not know that their religion may teach the same thing! The Bible is

quite clear to Jews and Christians that a equal standard should be applied to all things, and

that if one says that a certain practise make a religion false that same standard should be

applied to their religion as well. Let us start off by looking at what the Bible says about the

standards we use in the following verse:

A false balance is abomination to the LORD: but a just weight is his delight.

Proverbs 11:1 KJV

Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment, in meteyard, in weight, or in measure.

Leviticus 19:35 KJV

A double standard of weights and measures- both are disgusting to the LORD.

Proverbs 20:10 GWT

Shall I count them pure with the wicked balances, and with the bag of deceitful weights?

Micah 6:11 KJVA

Jesus in the New Testament emphasized this message many times to demonstrate that a double

standard is not from God and even illuminated us to the fact that the standard that we use for

others will be the standard that God will use for us when he judges us.

Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with

what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. And why beholdest thou the mote that

is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

Matthew 7:1-3 KJVA

Paul in the his epistles to the Corinthians specifically tells the Christian congregation to worry

about themselves and perfect themselves before they look for the imperfection in non-christians.

In my previous letter I said, “Don’t mix with the immoral.” I didn’t mean, of course, that you

were to have no contact at all with the immoral of this world, nor with any cheats or thieves or

idolaters – for that would mean going out of the world altogether! But in this letter I tell you not

to associate with any professing Christian who is known to be an impure man or a swindler,

an idolater, a man with a foul tongue, a drunkard or a thief. My instruction is: “Don’t even eat

with such a man.” Those outside the church it is not my business to judge. but surely it is your

business to judge those who are inside the church – God alone can judge those who are

outside. It is your plain duty to ‘put away from yourselves that wicked person’.

1 Corinthians 5:9 Phillips NT

So now let anyone who claims to be a Christian do as the scriptures say and judge ourselves

and use the standard we have applied to others. I shall address a few of the common

accusations about prophethood made against Muslims.

(Accusation 1) Islam has to be false because Muhammed claimed to be a prophet and was a

Gentile and not a Jew.

(Reply) According to the Old Testament there were many Gentile prophets but only seven are

mentioned by name in the Talmud (Baba Bathra 15b), However the story of baalim and Job

are two of many stories in the Bible about Gentile prophets.

(Accusation 2) Islam says there was 124,000 prophets sent to all the peoples of the world is

this not a ridiculous number; and how can it be said that all the gentiles were sent prophets?

Certainly this proves it is false.

(Reply) First of all the Jews believe there were many many prophets– In fact, the Talmud

(Megilah 14a) says that there were twice as many prophets as there were Israelites who left

Egypt during the exodus which would place the number at at least 1.2 million prophets. The

Bible also records prophets being sent to the gentiles such as when Jonah was sent to the

people of Nineveh. The Jewish Sages also believed that the torah had been given to all the

people in the world but only Israel accepted it when God forced them to by holding a

mountain over their heads (Talmud Sabbat 88a)

Let us therefore use a justice standard in all things whether we are Muslim Christian or Jew.

“O you who believe, you shall be absolutely equitable, and observe Allah, when you serve as

witnesses, even against yourselves, or your parents, or your relatives. Whether the accused

is rich or poor, Allah takes care of both. Therefore, do not be biased by your personal wishes.

If you deviate or disregard (this commandment), then Allah is fully Cognizant of everything

you do.” Quran 4:135

Another article from my dear friend ‘Abdullah’:

I find it truly amazing at times how people do not know their own religions beliefs yet feel fit to criticize the religious beliefs of others. Many times a person will attack a religion such as Islam for a trivial matter yet do not know that their religion may teach the same thing! The Bible is quite clear to Jews and Christians that a equal standard should be applied to all things, and that if one says that a certain practise make a religion false that same standard should be applied to their religion as well. Let us start off by looking at what the Bible says about the standards we use in the following verse:

 

Examining ‘Judeo-Christian’ Morals and Ethics

A friend of mine named “Abdullah” wrote a thought-provoking article which I would like to share:

Examining Judeo-Christian Morals and Ethics

Many times we hear the phrase “Judeo-Christian” morals and ethics, however are the

teachings that Jesus had different from the teachings of the Rabbinical sages and Judaism?

Many may find it shocking to discovery the truth that Jesus did not practice Judaism. Jesus

through divine revelation knew that the foundation of the true religion was not the Torah, but

the foundation of the true religion is God himself. The Torah was but one of the means in

which God conveyed his messages; yet even when the Torah became corrupted we were left

with a sure uncorrupted foundation, which is God. The Jews had the Torah yet chose to

corrupt it, they chose to leave the true foundation of religion by turning from the incorruptible

foundation(God) to the corruptible passions and whims of the Rabbis. In Judaism the Oral

Torah (The Talmud) is how one interprets the meaning of the written Torah ( the first five

books of the Old Testament). The Religion that Abraham and Moses preached was twisted so

that even the clearest of teachings and moral precepts were perverted. This led to the birth of

Judaism, a new religion not of God nor the patriarchs; a religion foreign to both Moses and

Abraham. Jewish exegesis was not focused on understanding God’s message but trying to

find a loophole and exception around his commands; and in some cases taking the verse so

out of context as to make the verse say something completely opposite of its intended

purpose. The authority of the rabbi over, and at times even above, God is most evident in the

Talmudic passage found in Baba Mezia (folio 59a&b). In this passage a great debate ensues

and God intervenes in order to settle the dispute, after proclaiming that one of the positions

were proper, however the rabbis rebuke God and say he has no grounds to interpret Torah

and it is the opinion of the majority consensus of rabbis that matters. To this God admits that

he had been out debated and defeated! When one steps back after being enraged by the

obvious blasphemy of the rabbis, one notices that in the story the idea of the majority is used

as some kind basis for determining the proper understanding of scripture, but where do they

get this idea? Believe it or not we are told by the various translations of the Talmud that are

footnoted as well as from Talmudic scholars that this is taken straight from the Torah itself!

Lets look at how they cite the verse:

Thou hast long since written in the Torah at Mount Sinai, After

the majority must one incline

Turn to your own Bibles and look at this verse yourself found in exodus 23:2 you will see it

says do not be inclined to follow the majority! We are told that if the majority is wrong then do

not follow them to do evil! Yet they make it an imperative to follow the majority of rabbis in all

matters.

In Islam one follows the Sunnah of the prophet Muhammed, and the same exists in

Judaism. Yet again we see a beautiful concept of following the example of God’s enlightened

messengers twisted and perverted just as the Torah is! In Judaism it is the Sunnah of the

rabbis, infact– if one begins studying this subject one will find that stories persist of students

being discovered by there rabbis hiding under their beds in order to observe their rabbis

engaging in sexual relations with their wife so that they follow the rabbinical Sunnah properly.

Lets take one final example to see If there is such a thing as Judeo-Christian morals and

ethics. Jesus Taught that we are to do unto others as we would want done unto us. Yet no

where in the Torah is this found! The Talmud which would not apply such a teach this to

gentiles, but only to Jews dealing with other Jews, has something similar. In the Talmud it is

stated:

What is hateful to you, do not to your fellow men.(note Talmud teaches that gentiles are not

fellow men but are regarded as animals) That is the entire Law; all the rest is commentary.

(Shab. 31a)

It is only Muhammed’s teachings that seem to actually echo the core message of Jesus in this

instance in the following quote:

No one of you is a believer until he desires for his brother

that which he desires for himself.

While the Jews say not to do what it hateful to other Jews, Both Jesus and Muahmmed say

do not just refrain from doing what is hateful but go further than that and do what is good for

your fellow man! It is clear that Muhammed and Jesus take a superior,positive, pro-active

approach!

The very philosophy of the teachings of Jesus are either superior or in contrast to

Judaism, when Judaism says an eye for an eye both Jesus and Muhammed say refrain from

retaliation and just turn the other cheek ( 40 Hadiths of An-Nawawi number 32 and Matthew

5.38-41) Judaism teaches to destroy anyone they deem an enemy and even gleefully

exclaiming that “even the best of the gentiles deserves death Yer. id. 66c; Massek. Soferim

xv. 10; Mek., Beshal-la , 27a; Tan., Wayera, ed. Buber, 20) .” Islam and Christianity teach

show love to your enemy that they might be won over to the truth and become the best of

friends (Matthew 5:44 and Quran 41:34) It is clear more than ever that Jews no longer

worship God but their rabbis they have exchanged God for their rabbis and that there is no

such thing as Judeo-Christian ethics but rather the proper term is Islamo-Christian ethics and

morals.

Examining Judeo-Christian Morals and Ethics

Many times we hear the phrase “Judeo-Christian” morals and ethics, however are the teachings that Jesus had different from the teachings of the Rabbinical sages and Judaism?

 

Deen Show: Was Jesus Crucified?

Taken from the Deen Show:

This weeks Guest is former Christian Dr. Dirks who is a former minister (deacon) of the United Methodist Church. He holds a Master’s degree in Divinity from Harvard University and a Doctorate in Psychology from the University of Denver. He’ll be giving us plenty of evidence to prove that Jesus(Peace be upon him) did not die for anyone’s sins nor was he crucified. This is part 1 and 2 together in this video

 

John 1:1 : The Logos is divine and not God

Before I mention the translations, I would like to point out that being divine ( or small g god) is different than actually being God. There is only one God in the Bible, but there are several small gods. For example Moses is called a god in Exodus 7:1, the judges are called god in Exodus 22:9, satan is called god in 2 cor 4:4.

 

 

LDS recognizes Muhammad(saw) as a Prophet of God

Church of Latter-Day Saints also known as the Mormons seems to recognize Prophet Muhammad(saw) as a prophet of God. Perhaps this is some sort of  perennialist  philosophy on their part. Anyways check this out.